Move in Black - attribute speed setting?

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Ric Posted: 07-01-2009 8:31 PM

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Hi All,
i'm trying to work out where  to control the speed of movement when moving in black.

A simple scenario.
Sequence step1/Preset 1
Movers down stage centre , no gobo, open white. full intensity.

Sequence step 3/ Preset 3
Movers Centre stage, Movers centre stage, lines gobo,  magenta, full intensity

I want them to move between these postions as quickly as possibly, but in dark, so that the movemet & change isn't visble.  I insert a sequence step 2/preset 2 with Movers down stage centre , no gobo, open white., NO intensity to make this happen. (fades out intensity, ready to move)
I then set this step to follow on to the next step ( step3) so it happens automatically.

The problem is that the movement takes much longer than necessary; the lamps fade up & are visible while the movement is happening. I know that the movers are capable of moving much faster into position/change attribute as I can move them manually or by focus positions.

Where do I control the speed of movement for the attributes while the Auto Mark/ move in Black is happening?
Does Congo take the speed for pan/tilt/colour/gobo  from the following/upcoming preset ( i.e step 3) in which case it's far too slow, or from the step where it's fading to black ( step 2) ?
If this is the case do I manually have to adjust each attribute speed, for each mover, so that my fade in/out times for other lamps are kept as I would like them to appear in that step? and is so, which step should control these times?

There is a default Show Setting which seems to control newly recorded movements, but not previously recorded presets/steps, and nothing I can find that seems to set the default for MiB/AutoMark times.

Thanks in advance,
Ric

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JPALMERLD replied on 07-01-2009 8:58 PM

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Hi Ric,

For a specific preset, try setting the devices that you want to move in dark to Go-IN-B and put a channel time on the devices.

Globally, if in setup you change the attribute time does this change the time to Auto Mark.

Similarily, if there is a time set on the preset for those devices does the automark run in that time?

I haven't played with this feature too much, so these are the suggestions that I can come up with quickly.

Take care,

John

P.S.  If you find something that works, please let all of us know.

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Pedro Alves replied on 07-01-2009 9:56 PM

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Hi Ric

If you don't want to see the light moving you have to create a step 2 with the movers at 0% and on step 3, if you use the GoOnB option, you go to times attributes and put a faster time like for instance if step 3 preset 3 has 4 sec you can put the time attributes with 0.5 sec. The only problem after this is how long the mechanic parts of the mover respond to that time.

When you Record a new preset you have that option to put a time or delay on attributes or you can do this on the Sequence tab or if you click with you mouse on the Time of the Preset that you have on the Playback tab.

Hope that this little things help you cause normally I use this when I use ours Revolution and don't want to see there movement. Sometimes I put a Delay Time on the Attributes time cause the fade out of the lamp it's a little bit longer than the time out of the preset.

Pedro Alves

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Richard replied on 07-02-2009 4:18 AM

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The movement time used by AutoMark and GoInB is the time in 'destination' / 'upcoming' Preset.

So all you need to do is set discrete times in that Preset.

If no discrete times are set, the movement time is the In time for the step.

You can set global F, C and/or B times that apply to all movements of that type in the cue using # [Time]&[Focus]
- Or [Color] or [Beam] respectively.
(This uses the Times In A/Times In B selection)

If you only want *some* attributes to move faster:

• # [Preset]&[Attrib] to open the Preset Attribute Editor.
• [Format]&[Down_Arrow] once or twice to show additional time cells in the spreadsheet
• Times in the "Device" column apply to all attributes of the device.
• Time in individual attribute columns apply to that particular attribute only.
  • You can use [Select]&[Arrow_Keys] to select a group of cells and set the time in many at once.
• Changes in this tab are updated automatically.

You can also do this in the Live Attribute Editor. Of course changes here need to be manually updated/recorded to store.

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Ric replied on 07-02-2009 6:33 PM

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Hi Guys,

Thanks for the replies. I've gone back & played using this as a guide. It now makes sense and I've put together a small cheat guide to assist my collegues when trying to achieve this.

I'd like to suggest a new FEATURE for the CONGO.
Under Fixture/Templates or even where they're patched have 2 MiB settings selectable and configurable.
i.e. Default ( FAST or 0.1 times on FCB) and QUIET (SLOW or 5 secs on FCB) allowing some quick and easy global settings for MiB logic, rather than having to do it on a Cue by Cue ( Sequence step by Sequence step) for each Mover. This would save a LOT of time where MiB is used extensively.

Below is a cut and paste of my 'guide'. I hope it makes sense and helps someone!

Using Movers with Move In Black/AutoMark

This is to have the movers transition to a new static position in a cue, without being noticed.

This will affect ALL moving lights on the cue, not just those moving in black. Changes to an individual light are much more involved.

Cue 1 Starting position. This is where the lights move/change from. Nothing special needs to be set here.

Cue 1.9 Transition cue. This is where the movers dim to 0% and nothing else changes

Cue 2 New position.  Auto follows from Cue 1.9 This is where the movers fade up in their new position/setting.

Cue 1.9 Fade out movers, set fade time (Out time) as required.

• Enter the cue number to record to and press REC once. (if asked to confirm recording attributes press REC again)

Cue 2  Set new cue, movers to new position/settings as required. Set fade in time (In Time) as required.

• Enter the cue number to record to and press REC once.
  On the dialogue box that pops up click on the Advanced tab
• Set F- Time, C-Time, B-Time to 0.1 secs. This is the move in black time coming IN to this cue!
  (setting a time of 0 will use the default times, longer times will be slower, and possibly quieter)
• Press REC  (if asked to confirm recording attributes press REC again)

Set up auto follow on linking cue1.9 to Cue 2

• Open Sequence list and find Cue 2
• Set WFA to W if not set already. Click on WFA Time.  Type 0.5 and press MODIFY
  (this is the time that Cue2 waits for AFTER Cue1.9 finishes before auto starting)
  (0.5 is the time taken for the mover to travel/change settings at MAXIMUM speed i.e. 0.1 secs as set in F/C/B-Time. Effectively it keeps the Mover at blackout (Cue1.9 state) for .5 secs before fading up (Cue2 state)

To summarise times/mover speed

Physical/Attribute Speed control overrides everything. If your mover is set to move slow via an attribute (i.e. focus speed, rotate gobo speed) then it can’t go faster.

If the physical/attribute speed is set to fastest then the speed of movement is controlled by the upcoming Cue FADE Time if F/C/B times are set to default (*** or 100%).
0.1 is the fastest possible as 0=default. For slow/quiet moves you may wish to set this to a much longer time.

The Wait or WFA time is to cover up the physical time that the transition takes. It will keep the lamp dimmed for that amount of time and then start the new Cue. This time may need to be increased for larger/ further or slower movements.

Cheers,
Ric